I’m a seasoned Linux user, but mostly for servers and services, not really for desktop use.
I’ve dabbled in some desktop distros on my personal rig a few times in the past, but ultimately due to specific games, I’ve gone back to Windows.
I recently installed Arch and KDE. Upon initial boot I noticed it was defaulted to Wayland. Every time I would try to log in it would just go to a black screen then cycle back to the login screen. Picking X11 would bring me to the desktop.
Basic Specs:
- AMD Ryzen 7 5800X 3D
- nVidia RTX 4090
I have been doing some reading into this and it looks like the issue is due to the proprietary nVidia drivers, but there are solutions to work around this.
I know nothing of Wayland other than its supposed to be more secure. My question is, is it worth the time/effort to get Wayland working? I primarily use my system for gaming. X11 seems to be working just fine for me right now.
Forgive me if I’m using some of the terminology wrong, still learning.
EDIT - Selling my gpu is not an option. I knew ahead of time that AMD has superior Linux support, but the 4090’s performance can’t be matched by anything AMD has. Maybe next upgrade I’ll go back to AMD if they have the top performer.
Has this place officially become a true Linux community? Did we just have the first X vs Wayland thread?!
That said, I use Wayland on all my machines, but I don’t have Nvidia hardware. I suggest just using X11 until Nvidia manages to do the needful. Personally I enjoy using wayland, things run so smoothly, I have zero issues with games and the only application I used that broke was Barrier, but I just used it for my Steam Deck and that problem is solved with SSH.
We still need the flatpak praise thread
I love Wayland but I’m not using Nvidia. I really hope th3y figure that Nvdia stuff out soon because it’s such a roadblock to many people when it comes to Wayland
Nvidia is the one who had things to figure out. Their poor support for GBM and closed drivers are the reason the Wayland developers have not been able to improve the experience on NVIDIA
X11 is deprecated, it’s been removed from RHEL, and hasn’t had dedicated maintainers for years. You might as well switch to Wayland (and xwayland if needed) now, it’s not really the case that you have an option.
Still no issues on Debian.
I imagine you’re talking about stability issues and not the numerous security flaws with X11 that are baked in to the protocol. Wayland is an improvement for many reasons, not just stability and the fact that it is actively developed unlike X11.
Some reading:
Oh, I’ve followed this stuff for years and years. I’ve been using Linux pretty much exclusively for a quarter of a century. People love to harp on the security issues, but from what I’ve seen that’s pretty much theoretical. The only real compelling argument is that developers are leaning toward Wayland, so that’s the way it will go. I’m sure some day I’ll go to update and it’ll be time to make that change.
I’m not a developer. I wasn’t super happy with the change to systemd, but it’s not like I was the one that had to deal with the init v issues, so when it changed, I went along. I’m sure the same will happen with Wayland. The last time I tried it, a lot of my decades of cruft didn’t work, shortcuts and workflow issues. Sure, I should probably clean up all that crap anyway, but like I said, it’ll happen when it happens. Until then, I’m completely happy with X11.
Just a head up to be careful with 7900 XTX if you do plan on getting an AMD GPU like other people on here are suggesting.
When I purchased 7900 XTX, AMD doesn’t offer me any way to control the fan speed on 7900 XTX and it always get stuck on 5% speed. I literally tried everything from using hwmon mode setting to manual (it stuck on auto and refuse to switch to manual), literally modifying the AMD GPU driver in kernel to forcibly set the manual mode for fan speed, it doesn’t work and instead it locks up the Kernel, and tried literally every application that exists for setting fan speed on 7900 XTX.
I tried to contact the manufacturer to refund me, they refused to pay me back in full and want me to reduce what I get back, I paid $1000 for it, they want me to pay $100 shipping and to only be qualified to receive $400 from them. I ended up keeping the 7900 XTX and basically went nuclear on fixing the GPU. This was literally within 1 week of receiving the GPU mind you. AMD is ranked far below Nvidia after my absurdly negative experience with them and I would rather go with Intel than AMD at this point and that is saying a lot, because it’s not only my GPU that is a problem, but it also with their software and driver like ROCm that NEVER worked, ever.
I created a plastic strap via 3D printing on top of the GPU and create a negative pressure fan to cool it down, it can stay under 50 degree Fahrenheit at 100% utilization.
Talk to a hardware youtuber, they might do a story on your shady GPU OEM
I recommend to just use wayland unless you have a specific reason not to. The main two reasons not to are requiring global shortcuts and having an nvidia GPU that won’t play nice.
You might just need to enable DRM KMS to get it working, in which case it may be worth using.
I would just wait if you’re on a nvidia card, all of the problems with nvidia on wayland are nvidias fault, and they’re supposedly releasing patches to fix this, but it’s taking forever and nvidia sucks.
If possible, sell it and get an amdgpu
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkfFvEeVC4w
It’s honestly a good idea to just sell.
Wayland is fundamentally better designed from the ground up, but isn’t extremely mature. Waiting is perfectly fine if you’re comfy on x11, but once wayland is the default everywhere, the linux desktop will be a significantly better experience in more ways than just security.
X11, for now. I don’t think I want to play Android games with WayDroid. I want my machine to obey my command, not the other way around.
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Little late to the party, but I’ll chime in. I have a 3080, and for the most part, Wayland works, but there are a few problems that keep me from using it as a daily driver. G-Sync doesn’t work at all, and when I put my PC to sleep, upon wake I end up needing to do a full reboot because of severe graphical issues. When it is running though, it’s pretty smooth, with only a few graphical issues here and there. I still daily drive X11 though until the major bugs are fixed.
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I would double check if you have
options nvidia_drm modeset=1in your modprobe.d. This is necessary for Wayland. I can login to KDE Wayland just fine with my 3090, but I still stick with X11 for now because of VRR and overall better input latency. The input latency issue isn’t an Nvidia specific thing, although Nvidia does perform worse with Wayland than AMD in some cases.And while you’re at it add
options nvidia NVreg_PreserveVideoMemoryAllocations=1so that your GPU saves video memory when your system suspends.This is the right answer. I can’t even count the number of times people have shrugged off Wayland because Arch doesn’t include this kernel parameter by default and they didn’t read the Arch wiki.
Enjoy your NVIDIA card in Linux, should bring you many surprises. Being much older now, i dont like surprises so I went with the AMD only solution. No more surprises!
