Well, it keeps getting worse until some point. But it took like a decade of shitty CDOs of CDOs finally collapsed in 2007.

It got to the point where strippers (and other not so wealthy people) where buying 2 or 3 houses aiming to flip.

Bubbles always bubble longer than expected

And if Trump does the trillions in tax cuts like hes trying to do, then the economy floats longer

overdue

That’s the problem. Bubbles keep growing until they don’t. And there’s no way to know when that will pop. This AI crap has been growing since 2016 AlphaGo or even 2012 IBM Watson.

Trump doesn’t do what he says he will do. Its pretty much random.

The reliable grift, such as anti-immigramt hate and anti-muslim stuff is obviously coming. And as awful as they will be, I’m not convinced that it will have an obvious effect on our economy.

When we start looking at things like Elon’s grift or other Billionaires he’s with, the stock market, crypto coins and other assets will go up. It seems unlikely to me that a crash would necessarily occur at the right timing you desire (this is bad for us in the long term. But the modern corporate economics world has become very good at hiding fraud and kicking cans down the road. Elon especially).

If they can hold most money together and make their supporters money (see Cryptocoin and Tesla stock right now), then they have a winning economic message for their core supporters.

Or do you think anyone actually gives a shit about how middle America will feel from this?

I’m not about conceding the information space.

What I’m saying is that without an allied media that you can actually trust to get the big news out, then people will be wondering about When Did Biden Drop Out again.

What if the economy doesn’t tank?

The President doesn’t have that much control over the economy. That’s a fundamental truth.

There will be awful policies but there’s no guarantee of an economic collapse here.

This is an election where people didn’t even know Biden wasn’t running anymore, as Google Trend searches of “Did Biden Drop Out of the Election” skyrocketed during the election.

And to be red, you have to want to take rights away from women and round up the immigrants.

Bwaaahahahaha. No.

To be Red doesn’t mean that. Republicans are just better at logrolling than you Democrats are.

If your allies are stinky racists, you roll up your sleeves and try to be a good Republican and make new arguments for your side that can drown out the racists. Why? Because allies are needed for power, and working with people you disagree with is more important for the cause than tearing down your allies.

Democrats need to become more RealPolitik. They need to be less ideal and more self serving if they hope to win elections in the future.

And you think you can do that when your opponent literally controls the outreach of your messages?

There is a +Elon Musk boost to Elons messages on Twitter. Furthermore, all the pro-Ukrainian posts systematically become NSFW and hidden from the timeline. Even when it is totally safe to view (like cute cat videos being shared by Ukrainian soldiers).

How the fuck do you get your message out on Twitter when Twitter specifically is being used to suppress your message?

Sure, that’s also sounds like a good disruption strategy.

The goal is to separate and disrupt us. And they will have fully paid specialists who strategize and are savvy on the latest arguments.

Anything that gets Democrats to tear each other apart is the goal. So we need to be careful about the whispers on the internet, and be more careful about thinking about who those whispers serve.

Or maybe, being a naive fool is how the left loses elections.

The Republican right explicitly builds media to serve them and tries to use media as a tool for control. And it works.

You can fight against the laws that empower this money system. But if you naively ignore the power structure and reality of today’s media landscape, you WILL BE DOOMED TO LOSE.

If you want to fight against it that’s… Fine. I get it. But you need power first and the current level of power Democrats wield is too low.

You are almost there but you are still slightly missing the point I’m trying to make.

Considering the fact that it is part of Russias strategy to polarize American politics to extremes

It is a specifically Russian strategy to demoralize the opposition through misinformation campaigns and the use of false flags.

A false leftist promoting a (on the surface) seemingly leftist point of view designed to disrupt and demoralize is within the Russian playbook. Case in point: Russians promoting both Blue Lives Matters and Black Lives Matters simultaneously, while specifically advocating for violence and otherwise making the discussion worse.

Now consider the messages that got out (and worked) in the last month of this election. Who created large arguments across Lemmy (pretending to be leftist) that Kamala is just as bad as Trumpon this issue?

Well, maybe some legitimate leftists believed that. But 100% if I were a Russian operative I know what message I’d be meming.

My brother in Christ you guys couldn’t be bothered to vote!

I think we need to discuss the serious chance that the Free Palestine message was designed to disrupt and demoralize the left.

We already know that the LA Times non-endorse + WashPo non-endorse + Gannett (who owns hundreds of local papers) non-endorse was specifically designed to demoralize us in the days before the election.

One Billionaires being scared of Trump making a non-endorse play? Okay I can believe that. Three that happened all within days of each other as a seemingly pre planned strategy??

No. Just no. We have some major enemies working against us and specifically trying to demoralize us this year. And it worked.

Why?

It’s almost like you have a major political party running disinformation against you that is hampering your enthusiasm across every known modern media platform or something.

I wonder who could be hurting the enthusiasm of the left with blatant attacks like the prevention of Newspaper endorsements, fake AI stories and possible algorithmic control of memes.

Cool. How will you lead these people? How will you communicate with all of them? How do you get all of them to trust you?

Well, you build up a network of trusted lieutenants who blitz the media with your message of unity. You organize your subordinates and their subordinates (and so on) until you have a network of trust with you at the top of it.

Of course, you will have competition. Run media disinformation campaigns on your supporters and the supporters of your opponents to hamper your opponents’s followers enthusiasm while increasing the enthusiasm of your own followers.

Spread vile lies if you have to. Contradict yourself repeatedly, say whatever you need to increase enthusiasm for your side while hampering enthusiasm for the other side.

Then get roughly 75 million people to vote for you while torpedoing the other woman candidate’s support to 68 million and win the 2024 election.

100 million isn’t needed, at least by my calculations. About 75 million is what you probably need. Perhaps in the past you might be led to believe that 80 million was needed (say in 2020), but as it turns out the hampering of the opponents support from 80 million down to 68 million is a better strategy.

We will not win the meme war when Elon Musk can silence our memes and outreach on Twitter through algorithmic manipulation.

It’s just like how Ukrainians keep getting censored on Twitter. It’s simply not a fair fight, the owner and algorithms are literally against you, and you likely have teams of internal Twitter programmers being commanded to tailor make algorithms to fight us.

We need social media we can trust. Lemmy is one of them but is too small. But we are somewhat safe here.

Elon Musk will never let leftist memes rise in popularity in X/Twitter ever again.

And I’m convinced that Gaza/Free Palestine was a TikTok disinformation campaign designed to tear Democrats/leftists apart.

We cannot trust any media. Indeed, we must assume they are working against us.

Building new, mainstream media, that allows our viewpoints to be heard is step#1. Do not rely on Twitter, TikTok, Reddit, Instagram, Threads, BlueSky, WashPo, local newspapers, local Sinclair news, LA Times.

We got like, TheAtlantic, The guardian and maybe PBS Frontline. Not exactly a powerful set of media to spread out viewpoints but it’s a start.

Lemmy.world and Mastodon seem like they are okay. But as noncorporate entities they will never be mainstream.

We aren’t getting rid of that in the next 4 years. And I’m a former Republican so I’m not exactly against corporate interests (indeed, corporate interests is where the money and support is).

I’m an anti Trump and as of now, former Republican. This was it for me, it’s clear that Republicans can never defeat MAGA so I’m switching to the Democrats side and gonna see what I can do here.

I get that Democrats are more liberal than me so I’ll accept my place as a minority view. But I’m not against corporate interests. I’m just against the disaster that’s about to happen here in America and now willing to join Democrats to stop it in 2026 and 2028.

Fair point.

Alas I do want a 2nd option aside from Trump. I do have morals after all.

The utter lack of RealPolitik in the Democrats mindset is a sickening level of nativity to me.

Right wing taking over all of traditional media, newspaper media, social media and the left being utterly blind to the media blitz behind the scenes.

No Democrat or leftist was ready to counter message the loss of Washington Post’s endorsement, even though it happened after LA Times loss of endorsement.

DNC as an organization is shit.

I’m talking to Democrats. I’m trying to tell you what your next move should be. The movement and overall organization of the Democrat Party goes above and beyond just its leadership.

I’m talking to you, specifically. First thing we must do is understand why we lost, and that means understanding how Trump won. And the first step there is to stop taking him as a buffoon (even if he is), because there’s a lot of people helping him succeed. We need to think about the whole enemy here, not just Trump but everyone who helped him this year.

And instead of complaining to DNC leadership (who obviously tried everything they could to stop Trump), start thinking about how to defeat MAGA Republicans. Donald Trump is absolutely a shittier candidate than Kamala in every way imaginable. Its not a policy loss here.