Other than your carrier give it for free or cheap, I don’t really see the reason why should you buy new phone. I’ve been using Redmi Note 9 for past 3 years and recently got my had on Poco F5. I don’t see the point of my ‘upgrade’. I sold it and come back to my Note 9. Gaming? Most of them are p2w or microtransaction garbage or just gimped version of its PC/Console counterpart. I mean, $400 still get you PS4, TV and Switch if you don’t mind buying used. At least here where I live. Storage? Dude, newer phone wont even let you have SD Card. Features? Well, all I see is newer phones take more features than it adds. Headphone jack, more ads, and repairability are to name a few. Battery? Just replace them. However, my Note 9 still get through day with one 80% charge in the dawn. Which takes 1 hour.
I am genuinely curious why newer phone always selling like hot cakes. Since there’s virtually no difference between 4gb of RAM and 12gb of RAM, or 12mp camera and 100mp camera on phone.
I mean, most of the population isn’t buying a new phone every year, it’s just that there are enough people using phones in general that at any given time there are people buying new models. It’s the same reason why there are people buying cars every year.
I personally use my phones for about 3 years. Sometimes up to 4, but usually year 3-4 is when the battery degradation gets so horribly bad and performance stutters so much that I figure if I’m going to do a full reset and buy a new battery and all that, I might as well get a new phone.
See thats where im with OP.
Lots of people do switch every 1-2 years.
And swapping a battery costs idk 40€ and an afternoon, full reset costs nothing and takes 20 minutes. Why would i generate that much trash and spend a thousand bucks on the latest shit thats 99% the same instead?
Capitalism and Marketing, bro.
I know, thats why it’s so annoying.
Just two more reasons not to do it.
I had a oneplus 2 since 2015 or so until upgrading to a 9 Pro in 2021.
Several important apps had locked me out and battery life slowly became a noticable problem. I would’ve been fine for another 3-5 years if the lineage image had still supplied android security updates.The only reason I had to replace my OP3 was because the buttons and screen broke down after 6 years. Battery was max 1 day but it worked for me.
Yeah everyone I know charges their phone over night every day anyway.
I had a 4 year old phone that I had to charge twice a day. I figuered I switch the battery with an official branded replacement which had costed around 100€. The difference between the old and new battery were unnoticable and I still had to charge the phone twice a day.
tough luck. Sounds like it was straining to keep up with background apps / OS updates rather than a broken battery.
Guess trouble shooting is half the battle in these cases.Perhaps the replacement battery was manufactured a while ago?
IPhone maybe? I know they restrict your battery capacity with software as your phone ages, so the short lifespan has nothing to do with the actual condition of the battery. Iirc some other brands do it to, but I don’t know which ones.
It‘s the other way around. Capacity decreases on its own just through usage. What Apple (and other manufacturers, as you said) does is decrease clock speeds of the CPU and RAM to make degraded batteries last longer. Basically trading performance for battery life. And that feature should deactivate automatically if the device senses a new battery being put in. At least it did with my old iPhone 6S.
Not charging my old phone to 100%, rather to 85% or 90% has helped with battery longevity immensely. After almost 5 years in use, accubattery still shows 80% battery health, and even if that’s not accurate, it still lasts quite a while. The SD625 that phone had was very sluggish though, so in the end I still replaced it
I used to do that, but it was a chore to keep monitoring my battery life. I wish there were a “charge phone to 80% and stop” option.
My samsung has the feature built in, but on that old phone I rooted and installed Advanced Charge Controller. (Not feasible for most people i know)
I don’t know why Google hasn’t put this feature directly into Android. It’s honestly one of the biggest pushes away from Pixel devices for me and it’s absolutely silly.
There are apps you can install to manage it for you on android, automatically cutting off charging when a given percentage is reached.
…huh, i wish i knew that earlier. I’m gonna search for it now.
Pretty sure this is root only. Normal apps don’t have access to the charge controller and I’ve never seen an app that claims to do this without root.
Samsung phones let you restrict the battery percentage to 85 percent. I think Apple does the same now.
The only real issue are updates. After just 3 years my previous phone didn’t get any security updates and I had to get new hardware. I actually liked my previous phone more than my current one. But it is how it is.
That’s the reason why I switched to iPhone after many years of Android, security updates are vital nowadays with all the sensitive data and apps we use on our phones, Apple is the only one that guarantees al least 5 years, iPhones are not too expensive if you don’t buy the latest models and I’d rather avoid supporting companies that don’t understand the importance of security.
Pixel actually guarantees 5 years now and if you put GrapheneOS on it, then you’ll have one of the most private and secure operating systems available
just a side note for graphene: i have the feeling that it’s not for everyone. “too much” security tends to get in the UX way
Chances are if you know how to use an Android, using Graphene isn’t too much harder. You can still download from the play store and run apps like normal. If you’re reading this post then you probably have the technical knowhow to plug your phone into the computer and press the start button.
Fair point with not being for everybody though, I wouldn’t be comfortable giving it to my non-techy family and friends. You do have a fair point.
I’ve been running GrapheneOS on my Pixel 3 for three years and I have few complaints. I still cant figure out how to get automatic updates to work in Android 13 with the Neo or Droidify stores but atleast the stock GOS apps auto update. BTW, to clarify what you said, we have to use the Aurora app to download from Google Play Store.
You’re right it’s not for most people. Not having Google services installed might be a major blow for people who have become accustomed to the conveniences they provide. I just use a separate vanilla Pixel for Google services if I need them, but the phone with my SIM card is the one with GrapheneOS.
You can turn Google Services on if you would like. I personally do have it turned on as some of my apps wouldn’t get notifications without it. You could use it as a normal android downloading through the play store and nobody would notice that it’s degoogled. All the apps are sandbox and you can change what permissions that have, I previously used CalyxOS and this is much more private and secure.
Does it send telemetry? Why is CalyxOS more secure?
Out of curiosity, which Pixel phone is a good one to have GrapheneOS installed on to last a long time?
The latest Pixel would get the longest update. They follow Google’s support updates which is 5 years from the time it is available for purchase.
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You can do even better than five years with Fairphone (…Speaking as a Pixel user)
But will Fairphone be around in 5 years?
It has been around for 10 years and 4 phones by now, and only gaining in popularity and market share. No reason to predict an early demise yet. The Fairphone 1 controversially only received 3 years of updates, but since then it’s 5 years.
Sad LG Noises
Fairphone is also guaranteed only 5 years. If not, then they are probably using a custom ROM that is not directly supported by Google. I’ll keep my eye out for this company though, the repairability is great and I love the repairability of the phone.
The article I just linked says they’re extending support to 7 years: Out to 2026 for their 2019 model, the Fairphone 3. The article also links to an older article talking about how the Fairphone 2 ended up with 7 years.
I’m in the US so the Fairphone was never really a consideration for me, but if it’s available whenever I need my next phone I’ll definitely look into it. It’s pretty annoying to be using Google’s own phone, and still only have access to 3 years of OS updates.
Interesting. So 7 years for the Fairphone 3 but it seems on their website, for the Fairphone 4, it is only 5 years, they might extend it to 7 years like their previous phones though.
Edit: Apparently Fairphone 4 is coming to the U.S, but with /e/os instead of the fairphone os.
https://shop.fairphone.com/?ref=header
https://www.fairphone.com/en/open-source/
https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2023/07/fairphone-is-coming-to-america/
Well, Google isn’t famous for being reliable in the long run with their services, Apple is proven at this point, tho who knows, I’ll wait a few years and see if Google is still at it with their Pixels.
Googles already been doing this for years.
Apple isn’t the only one that guarantees many years of updates. The fairphone (although currently only sold in the EU, they’re coming soon to the USA) has 5 years of promised support, Google Pixel 6 and later also have 5 years of promised updates, Samsung Galaxy, has 4 years, while one year less than its competitors, still much better than the 1-2 years most phones used to have. Android phones these days aren’t like the wild west back then, Android phones are on par with iPhones, the choice is merely personal preference.
Happy to hear companies are finally getting it.
I have just done the same.
Although Google are now promising 5 years of support for Pixel phones, Pixel phones are not a core business for Google, and as they have shown many times, Google will end projects at the drop of a hat with no regard for their customers.
There are secondary Android companies like Samsung that promise long term security updates, but are always behind the publishing curve compared to Google. This means that malicious actors have the opportunity to study Google’s published updates to reverse engineer cracks that they then exploit.
The current Android security update model is inherently insecure due to this issue. Until manufacturers are forced to update in a timely manner ( by which I mean simultaneously with Google) I won’t buy another Android phone.
Yeah exactly. It’s surprising how many people don’t check or care how long their device is being updated. Apple does a great job of supplying their devices with updates long-term.
If you stand there at the store with this year’s iPhone; take the full price divided by how many years you plan to own/ use it. Then you realize it’s actually relatively cheap.
iPhones have decent residual value as well. You should be able to recoup at least a third of the price after three years, if you look after it.
True, I bought an ipad more than 7 years ago to read because e-readers are too small for my liking.
I don’t use it much anymore since I have an e-writer now, but it still receives updates regularly, whatever comes to my phone comes to it as well, it’s impressive.
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Both Samsung and Google give you 5 years of updates (at least 3 major Android releases + 2 years of Security updates) for a few years now.
Pixel and Samsung also have 5 years of updates promised. And more phones are giving at least 3 years. I don’t think most people nowadays are hanging onto their 5 year old phones. Most everyone switches phones every 2 or 3 years.
I’m a fringe case then lol, I keep them until they actually break, they do last 4-5 years for me, sometimes more, I don’t make intense use of my phone, I much prefer using my PC for basically everything.
This is why we need law to mandate security updates for 5+ years.
That’s why I installed custom ROM on my Redmi Note 3 and used it for 4.5y until the battery swole.
If you are using an android phone, you can change the ROM to one that still gets updates, it’s like changing the os in a computer. The process will delete all of the user data inside the phone but you’ve got nothing to lose if it doesn’t get any security updates.
I recommend lineageOS to anyone wanting to go down this route because of its compatibility with every phone, old or new.
that “security update” quickly gets irrelevant as the exploits for lineage (or any non-standard rom) sells for pennies compared to a stock exploit. also no one’s paying security researchers to assess lineage - also it would be completely impossible with the amount of updates and devices they release
remember that (unfortunately) security is all about money
But more people using stock roms could potentially mean any exploit is more easily found compared to custom roms. Not saying that’s the case, but it’s a factor to consider.
as more people use a software it’s not easier to find exploits but much more profitable - and you see that propagate, as in:
- More people start to use a software
- Inevitably it gets hacked - by a kid most probably
- The company starts panicking due to bad press
- They start fixing the security bugs
- (some years pass)
- Now its quite difficult to find exploit as many security bugs have been fixed
- Exploit prices skyrocket since it would affect many users and it’s difficult to develop
- Bug bounty skyrockets since the exploits are so pricey
Now the last 2 steps tend to cycle since the security of the product fluctuates
Now the above have nothing to do with “residual” products - such as custom roms. And actually, you have so many deeply specialized people around the main product that finding a bug and developing an exploit on the residual is just a matter of “who the fuck cares”.
So you’re basing your security of your phone on “care”, also known as security through obscurity (some times at least).
Another example of “who cares” security is libreoffice. When I started as a security engineer the veteran (and boss) referred to it as training material to find security bugs. I found some, but who cares? Ain’t nobody gonna pay for them as “nobody” uses the software (keep in mind that we’re referring to millions of daily users rather than thousands per month)
Sorry for sheet! ❤️ Be safe and use a password manager
How difficult is it to change ROM?
hmmm depends on the phone and what you mean difficult. If you’ve managed to format a computer you’ll be fine. If you’re having trouble downloading chrome or office, maybe think about it again - I’m not saying you shouldn’t try or learn (everybody can learn), Im just saying that it will require an amount of time that I imagine would be uncomfortable to a user that don’t wanna bother downloading a program.
Not all people enjoy computers!
It depends. For Graphene OS, there is a web installer that the people who have used it said it was the easiest custom rom they’ve installed. Unfortunately, it only supports for Google Pixels.
For other custom roms… maybe not as easy…
Graphene OS Web Install: https://grapheneos.org/install/web
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Yes that’s true, but I’ve heard from others that the person involved has since stepped down from Graphene OS development, so it should be safe from now on.
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Hey there! Have you checked xda for unofficial ports or other ROMs? Might still be better than vanilla
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This.
If you have a phone with snapdragon CPU you probably can extend it’s lifespan with custom ROMs that offers security updates. Mine released in 2019, support dropped at android 11, but unofficial LOS with android 13 works great and still updates regularly. No complains here, even the OTA works. Although I do need to flash manually because of root. I don’t see myself upgrade anytime soon.
Switch to iPhone. Or pixel. Longer security updates. Guaranteed
I hope I dont jinx myself with this but I dont think security updates at the OS level are that important nowadays.
The main reason to do it is when the manufacturer no longer releases security updates for the phone. Given the security history and the typical corporate attitude of caring little for the customer, I want to minimize the risk posed by not having a very out of date operating system.
You don’t need a new phone every year to get this.
Some manufacturers drop support after a few years. It’s usually less frequent than every year but if you were worried about spyware or someone getting all those weird pictures you have saved to your camera roll it could make sense to upgrade for peace of mind.
“After a few years”. So if you have a few years why are you buying a new home every year?
Be honest with yourself. You’re addicted.
Wtf? Its a ridiculous BS situation that support is dropped so fast, but if you do anything remotely sensitive on your phone you should absolutely use a device receiving security support.
except even “short” support is two years, major companies like Samsung, Apple, and Google give 4+ years. The “gotta upgrade every year for security” is an excuse, not a reason.
Honestly just switch to a manufacturer that provides security updates for longer periods of time. My iPhone 5S, released nearly 10 years ago and is still getting them. Fairphone is another great example.
I feel like when I was younger and phone tech was changing a lot in the early days of the iOS and Android the difference even 1 year made was sometimes huge. Nowadays it’s much more incremental. A slight processor boost here, a couple GB of Ram there. I think a large part as to why that is is two things.
One, the tech has stagnated to some degree. Innovation doesn’t exactly sell a phone to regular non tech folks, a stable “don’t have to think about it” experience is what most people are after.
Two, a lot more issues with the cell phone platform are solved with software rather than throwing around more powerful hardware.
All that being said when I was younger I loved the idea of bleeding edge tech in my pocket, I upgraded all the time. The appeal was more customization at a lesser cost to performance, I wanted all the bells and whistles and less of the jank that came with it. I’m a little older now and lean much more towards the “give me something that works and doesn’t crash for the 10 minutes I have to look at my phone” club.
For those that upgrade to the latest iPhone/Pixel every year no matter what, I chalk that up to lots of expendable funds. It doesn’t appeal to me any more but I can also recognize that there are probably plenty of people out there now, like I was 10 years ago, so it could also be a general interest in the tech and how the bleeding edge keeps pushing for faster, more efficient technology.
I’ll pile on with a “Yup!”
While I fell into a pattern where I intend to upgrade every 2 years maybe 5 or 6 years ago, I’ve noticed in that same time frame that both the cost of new devices has gone up significantly and the durability of those devices has dropped.
I’m very easy on my phones. They spend a vast majority of their time on my desk, or plugged into my car. I’m old and boring enough that “going out” involves sitting down at a table at a nice dinner with friends and then going home. That said, the battery life on my phones starts to degrade after about a year. Various flaws start to creep up in the device. I’ve already had to replace the screen on my Pixel 7 Pro once – though, to be fair, it took a tumble from the couch onto a hardwood floor, but even that, really, shouldn’t turn the screen non-functional.
It’s disappointing to see that planned obsolescence rearing its head.
See, I am not easy on my phones and I wish they were more durable/glove friendly.
Pixels have extremely thin screens, apparently. I tried to get the battery replaced on an otherwise perfectly functioning Pixel a few years ago, but it ended up being cost prohibitive because replacing the battery also required replacing the screen which was “potato chip thin” according to the repair guy, and it was almost impossible to swap the battery without breaking it.
Because they welded the one consumable that needs replacement to force you to buy new every few years: the battery
Luckily for us Americans, the Europeans have their head on straight and can force companies to fix this by the end of the decade. So that’ll be nice at least
welded??
I don’t think a phone where the battery is welded to the body exists.
I know you’re probably being hyperbolic, but sealing a phone’s body construction to make it waterproof is very different from ‘welding’ the battery in.
Gaskets, o-rings, and screws exist. The waterproof argument is a weak one that doesn’t hold water. There’s no reason why it needs to be glued together and past phones have had waterproofing with a removable back and replaceable battery.
The point is that virtually every mobile on the market has a non-replaceable battery, and that’s a huge factor driving over-consumption via planned obsolescence.
They do? That sucks. I’ve only had iPhones and have gotten the battery replaced in both of them. It’s increased the lifespan of my phones by a couple of years, but it doesn’t double it. I usually start to sick of my hardware after about 5 years.
Your iPhone is the same and requires you to take it to a service center and pay someone else to do something that we’d been doing ourselves in 5 seconds for the previous 30 years.
The person you’re replying to is trying to push the narrative that modern smartphones (iPhones in particular) have bodies that are sealed with adhesive in order to force people to upgrade sooner, instead of to provide waterproofing/dustproofing.
That claim makes no sense in light of how Apple meaningfully supports phones for significantly longer than any other major OEM and goes to great lengths to preserve the usability of older devices. That doesn’t deter people from making that claim because they’d much rather believe apple bad, and other phone manufacturers bad because they’re trying to copy apple.
Inb4 but x phone from 2016 had a removable backplate and was “waterproof,” or but y phone with 0.01% market share is serviceable with a spudger and is “waterproof”.
Apple literally admitted it engages in planned obsolescence practices and has been fined in multiple jurisdictions for doing so.
Not sure why you feel the need to support shady business practices. There are designs that achieve waterproofing/dustproofing while still enabling replaceability. The obvious question then is why would the majority of manufacturers choose a design approach which restricts replaceability?
They’ve been a “not user serviceable” component since before phones got water proofing.
Additionally plenty of things can be disassembled with screws and such, that are waterproof… Watches come to mind.
The fact that they’re making it impossible for we the people and owners of the products, to change the battery isn’t a technological limitation, nor a practical one. They did it so people will be forced to seek help to get a new battery, at which time, the vendor/carrier/whomever, can simply upsell the end user.
They did it to sell more phones. If you believe anything other than that, I have some land in Alaska to sell you.
This is so pedantic and competely misses the point.
There is a HUGE difference in 4 and 12 GB of ram if you’re using 20 different apps at once that are all running background tasks.
The camera raw megapixel are of little significance these days but things like optical zoom or a larger sensor and aperture make a lot of difference.
The main reason to upgrade otherwise is unsupported OS versions. you’ll stop getting security updates leaving your phone vulnerable to attack.
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Vanity, marketing and buying shit unnecessarily.
I have a Fairphone 3 that I got in January 2020. Its a great device. I want to using it daily for between 5 to 10 years. And I have no doubt it will do that.
Meanwhile my brother has bought 3 Samsung devices in that time. And each one still works fine. He doesn’t need a new phone each time but he will still insist on it.
How’s the camera on this phone? Really the only thing I care about, next to battery life
The camera on the Fairphone 3 is only okay. But there is an upgraded camera module you can buy from Fairphone.
I’m not much of a photographer so it doesn’t bother me. But if you take a lot of pictures, it’s something to keep in mind.
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Foldables are the only interesting thing to have happened to smartphones in the past like 6-8 years. It’s kind of sad.
While the tech is cool, I don’t see folding screens as an improvement, at least for me. Sure, a larger screen would be nice, but I already carry a laptop that’s WAY more capable than any phone.
All the folding phones are more expensive, less durable, worse battery life, and the software still isn’t 100% even 4 generations in.If I actually cared about having a bigger screen on my phone, I could just buy a normal phone + a tablet for the same price as a foldable.
As an avid user of a foldable, the main points for me are around the convenience and flexibility. I mean, it is literally a bigger screen, but carried around in my pocket. At all times. I don’t need to juggle account information and managing battery and storing/swapping between two devices if I want a screen that’s bigger than a usual phone for playing games on (RCT Classic, Baldur’s Gate, Bloons, Arknights, Crashlands, RuneScape… Lots of great games benefit from the better precision of playing on a bigger screen).
It’s great for reading manga, reading PDFs, watching videos, running two apps side by side (ticket on one side, team chat on the other), each with the normal screen real estate if a whole phone!
I adore the ability to pull out my phone and use it one handed like a normal phone, but then instantly switch to a much bigger, more comfortable canvas running the exact same instance of an app the moment I need to do something more involved than typing a few sentences or scrolling on Lemmy. If I realize I want to type with two hands, it’s so much faster and more comfortable on the inner screen thanks to the split keyboard.
Then it’s on top of all of that that with a flip out kickstand case on it I can carry around a pocket folding keyboard+trackpad in the other pocket and a decent pair of earbuds and then if I’m out and about I can comfortably use it like a mini laptop, writing code with Neovim via Termux or writing things down in my Obsidian vault, or even just chatting - All without it feeling like I’m squinting at a tiny phone screen.
To be fair … That could just be the autism though.
I think you’ve convinced me it makes sense for the right person. Especially if it’s the only device you carry around.
I don’t game on my phone apart from some really simple ones like Minesweeper and Flow Free. Everything else I do is just reading, which I have no problem doing on my Galaxy S10’s screen. I never even considered that something like RCT or RuneScape could run on a phone now. All my serious gaming happens on a desktop or my Steam Deck.
Say what you will about huawei, but in the years when they were fighting to challenge Samsung, both companies made some exciting products.
Those days are long over
I buy a new phone when my current one breaks. So like every five years.
Lots of people are bad with money or don’t prioritize the same things I do. I try not to worry about this. I worry about other unimportant shit like why do people roll for stats in DND 5e.
why do people roll for stats in DND 5e.
Because having a wizard with 6 CON, a chronic disease, and a built in death wish is funny as hell
In the early 10s Smartphones evolved quickly and it was worth it to upgrade every 2nd year or even every year.
This changed when the tech stagnated. But smartphone was much cheaper in the early days so financially it probably isnt much different if you are buying flagships later now.
I’m the same, use the phone until it refuses to function any longer then jump on a Chinese site and get the cheapest pos with a decent camera and then once it arrives watch a yt video on how to change the language to English
Planned obsolescence wiki link
The world around you uses Instagram daily. They do need a better camera and all the AI photo enhancement filters. Plus, consumerism, you know.
Other than that, there’s no technical reason to buy anything better than what flafhsips were a few years back. I have one and it’s constantly underutilized.
I mean, maybe 5G or wifi 6 could be a reason to migrate.
Status symbol. That, and many people are horrible with their devices. They drop them and scratch them, crack the screen, chip them.
They abuse them and load them with tons of apps. Fill up the phone with videos and photos. The battery holds less of a charge because many people use their phones as computers and will constantly be cycling it dead 3 times a day or more.
Apps update and use more resources and space. They could just clean up their phone, do a reset, and have a case for protection but choose not to and just buy a new one.
It’s stupid I agree
The only time I ever “upgrade” is when I break a phone beyond reasonable repair. If batteries were easier / more cost effective to replace, I would keep this Pixel 4a a few more years. The battery is starting to lose capacity now, I’ll have to check on the cost of battery replacement before too long.
Considering a Fairphone next time I do upgrade.
Batteries are cheap to replace.
An important change is happening in many industries/ markets. To make devices easy to repair & enable OS updates many more years for long term use.
As someone who is currently using a fairphone 3, I cannot recommend it.
The idea is good, but let down by very cheap hardware. The fact is that, when you get the phone brand new, it’s already a very low end phone. Still having it 3 years later just means that it’ll be even worse. The fact that you can repair/replace most of it (but not upgrade) doesn’t change that fact.
I have been so disappointed with the experience on mine and would’ve replaced it ages ago if I could afford to.
Have to say, though, security updates are good.
Same. My next phone will be fairphone.
I totally agree :) I’m S10 until the thing melts, I managed to replace the battery under warranty and plan to rock it as long as humanly possible.
Headphone jack is a huge factor in that as I would not want to lose something I use every day, but also like you say, performance is fine! On top of that is the fact that I’m paying £8 a month for unlimited everything without a contract! :)
I guess there used to be a night and day change, and people kind of still expect that from the next flagship each time they’re offered an upgrade?
That said, these days the trends tend to steer into things I don’t use much, or improving what’s already good enough - its a good time to be on a budget I guess! :)
It used to be that a new phone came with a relatively substantial new feature set. People have become accustomed to this and businesses have been built around this. At this point, it’s mostly about consumerism.
I’m still rocking an iPhone 12 Mini without the slightest hiccup as well as an original iPhone SE as my main music player. I used to be the person who got every new phone because there used to be such a jump in performance and hardware features. Now I have no reason to upgrade at all. Honestly, I’d love to get rid of my phone all together and just use an iPad, Apple Watch, and my camera and journal.
