Earnest answers on the definition of a Tankie (as per the thread topic), bringing up their viewpoints or talking about the authoritarianism they promote were removed and users banned.
Source: https://lemmy.blahaj.zone/comment/17428405
Modlog: https://photon.lemmy.world/modlog?user=10894797
Source: https://discuss.tchncs.de/comment/21457702
Modlog: https://photon.lemmy.world/modlog?user=66486
Source https://lemmings.world/comment/18733315
Modlog https://photon.lemmy.world/modlog?user=16964962
Join the lemmy.ml boycott today and help foster a better Lemmy-verse! No more posts, comments (except to counter their propaganda ofc!) or upvotes on any comms on the Lemmy.ml instance! To make this easy you can do an instance block at Settings > Block Tab > Scroll to bottom > Input “lemmy.ml” and apply
And consider donating to individual instances instead.
Check the megathread for more!
@Afata@lemmings.world @Jean_le_Flambeur@discuss.tchncs.de @florencia@lemmy.blahaj.zone
@the_mighty_kracken@lemmy.world in response to your comment, it was not a mod, it was head lemmy.ml instance admin themselves that removed all those comments. This is what tankies do, be sure to check the megathread for even more documentation.
To be a communist is to believe in a system that will only ever work if humans are subtracted from it.
In other words, hopeless ideal.
On one hand I agree with you, we are very, very far away from from implementing it. To the point where “hopeless ideal” is a fair description of communism.
But on the other, to me it seems clear that all of known history is in a way a path towards the ideals of communism. Marx clearly was on to something, it is not by chance that his ideas had an enormous impact on human history. A completely hopeless, “alien” ideal does not take the world by storm.
The 20th century attempts at implementing communism were a disastrous failure, but that doesn’t mean there won’t be further attempts (perhaps ones that build upon new knowledge and the mistakes of the past). This is even relevant considering the current rise of an oligarchical, corrupt techno-feudalist global regime.
Really? Because everything you’ve just said can be applied to Fascism, albeit by entirely different paths traveled.
Has Fascism not taken the world by storm? Is Fascism not entirely hopeless? I can argue just as easily that Fascism simply hasn’t ever been implemented correctly, despite us having seen its disastrous results numerous times.
Edit: I wouldn’t, mind you, but I can. I’m opposed to both Fascism and Communism.
That’s a very fair point.
That being said, I don’t think Marx would have approved of the attempts at implementing communism in the 20th century.
Plus, I would argue it’s fair to say Marx’s heart was in the right place, the same cannot be said of the foundational elements of fascism.
I am also opposed to communism as it was implemented, but I do think the goal for a stateless, classless society is worth considering (at least on philosophical level).
Not at all. Some humans, absolutely yes. But not even remotely all. Plenty of us just want to be able to have a decent standard of living and just live our lives. Honestly if we as a general society simply discouraged and punished sociopathy it would go a long way to fixing things even. As opposed to worshiping it as we do today.
Any and every individual human being can be corrupted by power. You cannot remove enough human beings because everyone will be corrupted when faced with the same power over others.
Thinking otherwise is foolish, and the reason we are where we are today.
No they won’t. You definitely. That’s easy enough to tell because of your projection. Though I will commend you for at least having a round about Freudian sense of self-awareness.
No one claimed that power doesn’t corrupt. You’re just building a straw man. By the way, how’s that going for you? Of course, power tends to corrupt. That is well understood and there are concrete ways to address that. Whole philosophies. Were there a critical mass of the public willing to. keeping power small, local, granular and answerable for one.
The problem lies with the fact that, anyone who would seek power. Generally should never have power. Because they then take that power abuse it and use it. To secure the position so they can make sure that only other people like themselves who shouldn’t have it are the ones able to get it.
Serious question. If power wasn’t something to be won or claimed. If it was something gifted to you by your friends and neighbors. And limited to just your friends and neighbors only for a very limited time span. You know friends and neighbors, right? The people who know where you sleep and could strangle you in it, if you cross them. Do you honestly think they would all still rush to screw each other over still.
Basic accountability is like magic.
So you’re saying that this system of power can only be held up by those that don’t seek power? And you don’t see that as hopeless? All while trying to suggest that you simply wouldn’t become corrupt.
Yes I’m sure this is a worthwhile conversation, and definitely a good use of my time.
People thought pushing back against the divine right of kings was hopeless. Remind me what happened with that. You might be wasting your time. But not with this conversation. You can waste your time being hopeless all you want. That’s what they want. What they don’t want is us to realize that we far outnumber them. That this learned helplessness is useless. It’s absolutely an uphill battle, but it’s not remotely hopeless.
Nobody but the wealthy likes the current people in charge of government. Not Republican voters, not Democrat voters, not Third Party voters. All we have to do is decide that we’re done. And people are closer to that now than they have been for 100 years.
I gotta disagree with this last part, at least for the US.
Neither of us can know for sure. And I’m just drawing from my background living in the Midwest, Misery/Kansas area. And believe me. I’m not trying to paint Trump or Republican voters in a good light.They’re dumb as fuck, and twice as spiteful. But they’re struggling to support him right now.
Deploying the Gestapo at night to invade Americans’ homes and assault them in their sleep isn’t helping them. Blowing up South American fishermen in the middle of the ocean, isn’t helping them. Paying billions of dollars to a failed libertarian South American state isn’t helping them. Trump realistically has reneged on every promise he’s made to these people. Just done petty vindictive things and been a general embarrassment. The cultish true believers aren’t even close to the majority of this negative brain trust.
Outside of STL and KC Democrats don’t exist. And a lot of these people are really getting tired of fighting against things. They’d much rather have something to fight for. If someone with the vision and speaking chops of Mamdani, though a bit more palatable to their xenophobia were to offer it. I think they’d surprise people.
As was famously said
I hope I am wrong, but from my time living in the US (and travelling extensively, not only purely in the geographical sense), I have my doubts about the alleged willingness of Americans to support democracy, good governance and freedom of speech (in the real sense, not in the superficial American sense).
US did not seem like the kind of place where a significant part of the population values freedom beyond ostentatious theatrics.
Don’t get me wrong, US is a great place, lots of goood people, lots to see, but also it would be naive of me to deny reality.
Yes, the people you’re saying do not seek power should seize power. You’re also willfully ignoring how contradictory and naive what you’re saying is.
In seizing power those who may not have sought it before become those who seek it in the future. It all comes down to opportunity, and for you to sit here and suggest to me that you wouldn’t fall to corruption makes me want to slap you in the mouth. What a pompous statement.
You’ve learned nothing.